KH 7 ???

Mercury Outboard  general discussion

KH 7 ???

Postby bh/ » Thu Dec 13, 2018 5:50 pm

At the recent FL/GATOR AOMC meet here at Lake Placid,  there was a near perfect KH-7 that won best post war .  
It had a front cowl mounted fuel gauge,   2" diam ?,  looked factory or good after market . Never saw one before  [violin.gif]
Wondered how it operated ?  Could not find the owner, nor take a pic .
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby mercules » Thu Dec 13, 2018 8:33 pm

Here's the Cruiser page from the '51 catalog and it doesn't explain the gage; I can't see the need for one on a gravity fed carb.
1951-catalog-g.jpg
Let's fix it now - before we launch the boat.
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby dave bernard » Thu Dec 13, 2018 8:51 pm

the shift handle in the pic is not what merc used. artist rendition. I guess.
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby mercules » Thu Dec 13, 2018 9:42 pm

Is it possibly a fuel level gage? I was thinking pressure gage.
Let's fix it now - before we launch the boat.
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby bh/ » Fri Dec 14, 2018 12:39 am

It was a fuel level gauge, same as one in pic, and I was wondering
if it worked mechanically, [float] or by pressure ?
The shift lever was as in the pic, ie; vertical.
We  all thought that it had  been bent that way
Seems it was OEM .
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby mercules » Fri Dec 14, 2018 11:32 pm

I've just realized that there will be pressure from the weight of the fuel and if you calibrated a gage to read 0, 1/2, Full (instead of 0, .5, 1 psi) you can tell the fuel level. They were probably already thinking of the external tank for the Mark 20 so they only made a few. Does anyone have a parts diagram that shows this? I don't see it in my manual.
Let's fix it now - before we launch the boat.
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby mercaholic » Sat Dec 15, 2018 5:03 pm

Brian, are there any pics of that early model that you can post up here ?

I'm sure a lot of us would like to see that early prototype Cruiser.
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby bh/ » Mon Dec 17, 2018 6:26 am

John; -the owner came in a Porsche SUV  and parked in a far corner of the lot, next to where i parked,  and noticed his one motor display.
Few of us spotted it, though he won ' best post war', but I wonder if the  judge realized  the rarity of the OEM  gauge or vertical shift lever.
The motor was 10/10 in all respects !
Regrettably I did not bring a camera/ phone . One of the FL mbrs  must have pix ?
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby Ram Jet » Fri Feb 15, 2019 5:39 am

bh/ wrote:It was a fuel level gauge, same as one in pic, and I was wondering
if it worked mechanically, [float] or by pressure ?
The shift lever was as in the pic, ie; vertical.
We  all thought that it had  been bent that way
Seems it was OEM .


On my KH7 the shift lever is straight.

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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby bh/ » Sun Mar 10, 2019 9:04 pm

[quote="mercaholic"]Brian, are there any pics of that early model that you can post up here ?

-from the  FL GATOR Chapter WINTER 2018 newsletter .
Note the OEM 'vertical' shift lever and fuel gauge.
Attachments
KH-7 1952.jpg
Lake Placid FL DEC 18
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby mercules » Sun Mar 10, 2019 9:26 pm

Does anyone know William Donnelly? Can we contact him? I would assume he knows how the fuel gage works and would like to know for my own reference and see if I guessed right; that it uses fuel pressure (weight) to move the needle which is translated into levels
Let's fix it now - before we launch the boat.
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby bh/ » Sun Mar 10, 2019 9:38 pm

-he was at the meet here on SAT, 9th,
as  his Porsche was parked there, but did not speak to him,
nor did he bring the KH-7.
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby mercaholic » Mon Mar 11, 2019 12:28 pm

I'll bet that with that shift lever angled that way that removal of the lower shroud would have been difficult.
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby 1500J » Mon Mar 11, 2019 3:37 pm

Is the top cowling/tank the same as other models?  Curious if others would fit it.

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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby 1500J » Thu Mar 14, 2019 1:46 am

1500J wrote:Is the top cowling/tank the same as other models?  Curious if others would fit it.

Conrad


Is this a stumper of a question ?   Curious is all.   Thanks
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby Tom Brockmeyer » Thu Mar 14, 2019 2:26 am

1500J wrote:Is this a stumper of a question ?   Curious is all.   Thanks


Yes... Because no one here on JOMS has ever seen that engine up close and personal before and have no experience with it at all.  The question would seriously be is this actually a "REAL" engine or a clever rendition built to look like a an artist's redition from a Kiekhaefer marketing dream?

Kind of like the Mark58H next to a Mark78H I saw at Clayton, NY many years ago...  The owner had a machine shop make the faceplates (very well done, but fake) and used the APBA rule book approval of the proposed engines as so called proof that they had actually existed.
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby 1500J » Thu Mar 14, 2019 3:40 am

Thanks Tom- I am unsure of its authenticity.  It
Is very interesting.  I’ll post my question on my project thread with a better clarity.
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby Tom Brockmeyer » Thu Mar 14, 2019 1:18 pm

Ok, I see Conrad...  I thought you were asking about William Donnelly's KH-7 tank with the "never seen in person" fuel gauge attached.
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby 1500J » Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:43 pm

Tom Brockmeyer wrote:Ok, I see Conrad...  I thought you were asking about William Donnelly's KH-7 tank with the "never seen in person" fuel gauge attached.



I dont think the tank is anything extra ordinary on Mr Donnelly's KH7.  Everything unique starts lower than the tank it looks.

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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby Tom Brockmeyer » Thu Mar 14, 2019 11:58 pm

1500J wrote: I dont think the tank is anything extraordinary on Mr Donnelly's KH7.  Everything unique starts lower than the tank it looks. -Conrad


I figure William Donnelly's KH-7 tank is unique with whatever connection is running the fuel gauge...  I doubt it's a pressure gauge myself since it would be very difficult to calibrate over only a few inches of water column pressure.  I think it's more likely a mechanical connection of some sort.
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby Yellowjacket » Fri Mar 15, 2019 12:00 am

Hard to see how that fuel level gage works.  If it is just a pressure gage it would have to be able to read a very low pressure and would likely bounce around a lot whenever the boat was bouncing around.   If it was a pressure gage it could just be tapped into the carb feed line with a T and that would be a really simple way to do it.  If it was mechanical with some type of float there has to be some linkage in the tank between the float and the gage, which would mean a different tank.    Not simple or cheap really and I can see why they didn't produce it in numbers.
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby 1500J » Fri Mar 15, 2019 4:46 pm

I posted on the AOMCI FB page for more info. So far nothing.  Ill let you know if someone speaks up about it.

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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby bh/ » Sat Mar 16, 2019 3:29 pm

I doubt also that it would have been a pressure gauge, as the pressure would only vary from approx 3 to 1.5 psi , full to empty. Easy to do today electronically, but difficult and expensive then with a simple mechanical pressure gauge. If the mechanism was a float/lever style, common  in the remote gas tanks, then a rod would need to descend from the bottom of the tank, through a gas proof bushing of some sort, which would be problematic at best . A slow drip of gas in side that cowling would have been dangerous . I suspect this idea never got past the prototype stage, or, this one could have been a one off boat show special ?  
The vertical shift lever makes sense, as the competing OMCs and S-As had vertical side mounted ones .
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby buff5 » Sat Mar 16, 2019 4:40 pm

So what is the big SECRET here?, how come the owner has not shared by taking off the lower cowl & posting pictures for all to see, if the fuel indicator is indeed a functional operating indicator or just a "Mock Up" pre-production artist rendition. Carl was great at doing that to fool every one, to include the other major outboard motor brands, just look at Mercury's introduction advertising of the then" NEW" 4 cylinder, Mercury 25 Thunderbolt, of which I have a original brochure of the Green Tanker 4 cylinder which was NEVER produced, but a "mock-up" was made & photographed in their advance advertising. I also posted a picture of that brochure on this board or the AOMCI board or both?????, I cannot remember. I also had the opportunity to personally examine that 'mock-up" which was basically, just a shell, & under the covers was really far from a operating outboard motor 2 KG7 powerheads somewhat mated to have 2 cylinder facing ford & 2 facing to the rear, or a forward & aft 4 cylinder powerhead, NO carb, No ignition just a complete fabricated "FAKE" motor. This club is to SHARE information with other members, NOT to hide those facts!!!!. I look forward to a full disclosure of the "STRANGE" KF7.
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Last edited by buff5 on Sat Mar 16, 2019 4:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby buff5 » Sat Mar 16, 2019 4:52 pm

I must have posted that 25 Thunderbolt information on the AOMCI site, as I just tried to do that on this board & it said picture is to large, & I do not know how to down size it. Perhaps someone can, if so let me know your email & I will send the picture so it can be shown on this board. This original Mercury advertising is the ONLY one I have ever seen in decades of collecting outboard  items.
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby Tom Brockmeyer » Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:45 pm

Ron, no need to go on about it here... William Donnelly isn't a member of JohnsOldMercurySite.  As stated above, a JOMS member has posted over on the AOMCI site for more information.
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Re: KH 7 ???

Postby buff5 » Sat Mar 16, 2019 10:45 pm

Tom; Yes I seen that so will just have to wait & see, inquiring minds would like to know!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!LOL
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